Pole Dancing Ministry?

Many times we think that things in the Christian Church cannot sink any lower, then along comes a story that proves us wrong. This is one of them.

The Ledger, a newspaper in Florida has a story about two Christian women who've opened up a health club that features Pole Dancing. Yes, this is the very same 'pole dancing' made famous in strip clubs. Said one of these Christian women:

"We wanted to take the stigma off it. We don't do any exotic at all; we're not into that. We're two Christian women. It's not about nudity; it's about getting your body to the place you want to be and not being judged."

Here is the link to the Ledger Story.

With the way things are going in the church it is now just a matter of time before some innovative pastor finds a way to weave pole-dancing into church. These women have already taken the first step. Below is a satirical story we've written that we are certain will become reality within the next few years.

--- begin satirical/prophetic news story ---

Abundant Life Fellowship, the church that bills itself as the church where you can "Experience God's Perfect Plan For Your Life, Today" is proudly reporting that 66 people gave their hearts to Jesus during the first performance of their new "Pole Dancing Ministry".

Several on-line discernment ministries have spoken out against the event saying that it is "inappropriate for churches to use pole dancing for evangelism."

Pole dancing which is a popular form of entertainment in strip clubs has been working its way into the main stream over the last several years with several companies and health clubs offering it as a way for women to shape and tone their bodies.

Pastor Steven Ignoble of Abundant Life Fellowship defends his decision to use pole dancing for reaching the un-churched. Said Ignoble:

"There were 66 people who came to Jesus because of this outreach event! God is the one who made the female body and I am sure that God has no problem with these women using their bodies to spread the gospel. Plus our ladies never take all of their clothes off so this is way different than what happens in a strip club. Yes, it is true that Satan has been using Pole Dancing for decades as a way to snare men into sinning. But, that is precisely why the church should be rejoicing about the fact that we've taken pole dancing away from the enemy and are using it to advance God's Kingdom. While those 'discernment' ministries are attacking us and ripping our methods...Heaven is rejoicing in the victory of 66 people having their names written in the Book of Life!!!"

Pastor Ignoble also plans to incorporate this new ministry into the regular Sunday morning praise and worship services by setting up two poles on opposite sides of the stage for these ladies praise the Lord with.

Comments

[Steve R]

Reminds me of the line for women to become 'Hookers for Jesus' used by the Moonies back in the 70's. Nothing new under the sun, eh?

[T.J.]

I'm gonna tell it like it is and it will not sound pleasant. THESE WOOMEN ARE IDIOTS!!!...I am a woman....these women have the "countenance" of the world...you can see it on their face and in there eyes....the blond one looks like she could have just come out of a smoke filled bar. Next point....this is stirring up the lust of the flesh....ok..your door is locked and you're swinging on a pole. Are any of these women thinking about Jesus as they do this? PROBABLY NOT....ok....you're swinging on a pole, stirring up the lust of the flesh...."America Woman" blasting in the background...these women are in lesbain training. Seriously....one day the wine will come out...the swinging on the pole will heat up and you'll have a lesbian orgy....OR.....you'll know how to "tease your man".

THIS MAKES WE WANT TO VOMIT....and I am no prude because in my own "hell's bells" days this type of behavior seemed normal. The fact that these women "are Christians" may bring this very sensual idea to the next "ladies meeting".

I'm telling you there has been a lustfilled spirit released upon the body of CHrist. Rob Bell and his SEX GOD book...Juanita Bynum /Bishop Weeks with their "name your wife's fav. body part" game show..the erotica church in the UK sson to come to the USA I'm sure...and now Pole dancers for Jesus.....

COME FOR US LORD.....THE PLANET IS A MESS!!!

[Mrs. Pilgrim]

"It's not about nudity; it's about getting your body to the place you want to be and not being judged."

Really? Isn't it funny that that quote comes directly after the following?

"But law-enforcement officials--as well as would-be voyeurs--can relax: Nudity is not an element of the weekly classes, which are private and only open to women.

"'We've had men who wanted to come and watch,' Moore said. 'I've told them, "You can't afford it."'"

Okay, so if it's not erotic, why can't men come and watch? Aren't we trying to "remove the stigma" here? Hmmm?

And furthermore, "You can't afford it"? Um, that's hooker talk. Ladies don't talk like that.

And then there's this gem: "'I find myself walking around in the kitchen sexy,' Walker said, noting the activity's effects. 'I don't care what you look like, when you do this you feel it. You get into the mood.'"

Nope, not erotic at all. And it can't possibly do anything to your morality:

"'They make it look a lot easier in strip clubs, and I give them a lot more respect for what they do now,' [Montes] said."

And then: "'Everybody dreams to have a pole in their room. It spices up everybody's life.'" Um, either you didn't ask my opinion, or I'm not anybody. Frankly, the last thing I need in my bedroom is something for me to walk into in the middle of the night without my glasses on, or fall off of and break my ankle. Between exersaucers, strollers, and swings, I'm in enough danger as it is.

My final assessment: They can squawk all they want about how there's no sexuality attached to this, but every other word that they say proves that they're LYING.

[Ken J.]

66 people came to Jesus? PROVE IT. I really mean that. I don't allow that as a justification anymore, because what does it mean in circus "churches" to "come to Jesus"? I assure you it doesn't mean the same thing as it meant to the apostles in Acts.

I suppose a "church" can hold a seance so long as somebody there "comes to Jesus".

[Al]

If it's not exotic dancing, then why aren't the men also pole dancing? Don't they need to tone their bodies? Shouldn't they also be helping to "spread the gospel" in this way?

After all, in Christ, there is neither male nor female.

No?

Then, maybe, both could spread the gospel in this way: line dancing in the spirit?

[Jonothan]

Ken:

your right, I would highly doubt that 66 people came to Christ because of pole dancers. but that story isnt real. it was satire (and pretty accurate satire at that). unless you were being sarcastic and i just didnt get it. if thats the case, sorry about that.

Jon

[Julie]

I was embarassed for all of the women in both videos. They looked ridiculous in those stylettos. I hope the ALF Church has good liability insurance for this type of activity. Makes me think of Os Guinness's Book "Fit Bodies, Fat Minds." These women would be better off exercising their heart and minds in the Word of God (that is if they could find a God-fearing teacher). What next? Chippendales for Jesus? Lord, please forgive us and have mercy on us all.

[DJackson]

Where is this Abundant Life Fellowship church, I'd really like to find their website and see what they are, but there's a bunch out there unfortunately, anyone have a link to this heretical place?

Truly an abomination!

[DJackson]

Ahh, dumb me, I didn't see the satire, here I was looking for the real church. :P

[Ken J.]

Jon,

Ha, okay I get it now. Sorry about that!

But the truth is, how many use something like this and then try to justify it by saying the masses have all come to Jesus and there's no unbelievers left on earth LOL. Your satire was right on.

[JessilynT]

OH NO! FEMALE EMPOWERMENT! WHAT ARE WE GOING TO DO?!?!??!

T.J.--You need to go ask God to forgive you for all the hate you were spewing. Come on--Gonna become Lesbians?! Is that what you would do if you were with a group of women & "the wine came out" as you said it?! Someone's repressed!

Mrs. Pilgrim --The reason men aren't allowed is because it's not FOR them like stripping in a club is. Female empowerment -- not Jonny Gets His Rocks Off. The description of you bumping into a pole at night painted a "frumpy" picture, so I will assume that's a big part of why you can't identify with women who are confident about their bodies.

Ken J.--Prove it? & here we are talking about a religion based on having "Faith" of God's existence.........not proof. I guess it's only when you're trying to argue something on your side that Faith over Proof is ok.

Al--FYI there are MALE pole dancers(that AREN'T gay). Sometimes, they take private lessons or all male classes. Just depends on the studio & the other participates feelings towards it.

DON'T KNOCK IT TIL YOU'VE TRIED IT!!!!

[AnnaJackson]

If that's "female empowerment," then may it be dammed to Hell.

"confident about their bodies..." Give me a break! I'm a woman, and I'm plenty "empowered" without this filth.

JessilynT, if you claim to be a Christian, you need to carefully examine your own heart. There are several Biblical principles here that you need to take note of:

1. Women are commanded to dress modestly for a reason. Men are aroused by what they see. Any woman, who through immodest clothing (or sexualized gyrations around a pole) is then a liable party to the commission of adultery of the heart. (1 Timothy 2:9, Matthew 5:28)

2. Christians are commanded to not have even the smallest HINT of sexual immorality among them. This is WAY MORE than a hint. (Ephesians 5:3)

3. A genuine Christian would give up personal freedom, in ANY area, rather than cause another Christian to stumble. (Romans 14:20)

JessilynT, I suggest you visit http://www.needGod.com/ and take the "Good Person Test" to see if you're good enough to make it to Heaven.

[JessilynT]

How is it "filth", "sexual immorality" or a "commission of adultery of the heart" if the only man I dance for is the husband I married in a house of God?

[AnnaJackson]

Christian women do not gather together in "classes" to practice the sexual ANYTHING. Imagine a supposed "Christian" class for women to practice the best way to sexually please their husbands... perhaps they could practice different acrobatic sexual positions... This pole dancing class is no different.

Sexuallity is reserved for the purity of the Christian marriage bed. One husband, one wife. That's it. The end.

JessilynT, I suggest you visit http://www.needGod.com/ and take the "Good Person Test" to see if you're good enough to make it to Heaven.

[Neil]

Let me get this straight, Christian "Pole-Dancing" as an evangelical tool.. Wow. I just can't see the relevance between dancing women (naked or not) and Jesus Christ's death in the cross of calvary 2000 years ago. My question is, does the church really need to use the methods of the world to claim the lost for Christ? Is God's word not enough?

Malachi 1:6-14
6 “ A son honors his father,
And a servant his master.
If then I am the Father,
Where is My honor?
And if I am a Master,
Where is My reverence?
Says the LORD of hosts
To you priests who despise My name.
Yet you say, ‘In what way have we despised Your name?’
7 “ You offer defiled food on My altar,
But say,

‘ In what way have we defiled You?’
By saying,

‘ The table of the LORD is contemptible.’
8 And when you offer the blind as a sacrifice,
Is it not evil?
And when you offer the lame and sick,
Is it not evil?
Offer it then to your governor!
Would he be pleased with you?
Would he accept you favorably?”
Says the LORD of hosts.
9 “ But now entreat God’s favor,
That He may be gracious to us.
Whilethis is being done by your hands,
Will He accept you favorably?”
Says the LORD of hosts.
10 “ Who is there even among you who would shut the doors,
So that you would not kindle fire on My altar in vain?
I have no pleasure in you,”
Says the LORD of hosts,

“ Nor will I accept an offering from your hands.
11 For from the rising of the sun, even to its going down,
My name shall be great among the Gentiles;
In every place incense shall be offered to My name,
And a pure offering;
For My name shall be great among the nations,”
Says the LORD of hosts.
12 “ But you profane it,
In that you say,

‘ The table of the LORD[b] is defiled;
And its fruit, its food, is contemptible.’
13 You also say,

‘ Oh, what a weariness!’
And you sneer at it,”
Says the LORD of hosts.

“ And you bring the stolen, the lame, and the sick;
Thus you bring an offering!
Should I accept this from your hand?”
Says the LORD.
14 “ But cursed be the deceiver
Who has in his flock a male,
And takes a vow,
But sacrifices to the Lord what is blemished—
For I am a great King,”
Says the LORD of hosts,

“ And My name is to be feared among the nations.

[merry]

Jessilyn T, your comment was so incredibly rude I'm almost amazed. No one here is "frumpy." I actually recoil at the sight of that word; it is so incredibly disrespectful. I would kindly ask that you apologize. There is a HUGE difference between being confident about your body and feeling the need to show it off; the latter usually reflects insecurity and a desperate need for attention--only God can meet that need.

[Anony-mouse]

Quote: [I suggest you visit http://www.needGod.com/ and take the "Good Person Test" to see if you're good enough to make it to Heaven.]

So that would be someone JUDGING then...? cos a website definitely isn't in any position to claim to BE God.

[Adam]

I encourage you to look at the test before judging it yourself. The name may sound misleading, but it is actually a good test.

[T.J.]

Jessilyn, if you'd read more than entertainment magazines you'd understand PORN is sweeping in the female arena just as it dominates in the male arena. I read news from all over the place and about a variety of topics.....I also know that Israel is getting ready to hand over the Temple Mount in the hpoes of "peace" and THIS IS HUGE prophetically....but back to the topic at hand.....Do we have MORE or less lesbians out in the public arena , say, since 1950.....MORE or less...you know the answer is MORE....so I'm not repressed and I'm not spewing hate. If you can not understand that POLE DANCING is PORNOGRAPHIC I can not help you. Anyone who tries to SANITIZE it under the banner of "christian" is dangerous. And this is why I am taking a stand against it. We have "christians" who do and watch and listen to and read all sorts of ungodly things. And yet they say...."hey....I'm a strong christian"......pole dancing is in that category......Jesus would not condone it, I'm sure.

[DJackson]

This kind of stuff makes me sick. It's neither God honoring, nor is it honoring to the husband, but rather letting the husband feel confortable with bridging the gap between porn outside the homa and then bringing porn into the home.

Neil's scriputre from Malachi hits it where it hurts. The truth is, that this "act" is VERY ungodly and should never be imitated by Christians.

For a Godly understanding of sex between a husband and wife (which God created) let's look to Song of Solomon and not the worldly and filthy acts of immorality.

Stop getting examples from the world and bringing them to "enhnace" one's life.

We are in the world NOT called to be OF the world.

[Jacqui]

With respect, you seem to know very little about pole exercise, and that shows in your comments. However, I accept that you are entitled to your opinions, so I'm not going to berate you for your views, no matter how much you are berating others for THEIR views. I was always taught that good Christian attitudes included tolerence, respect and love for thy fellow man. I'm very sorry to say that you do not seem to be showing any of this values at this time. You are judging us without really know ing what you are judging us for. Is this a Christian attitude? Look into yourselves, and then answer honestly.

And incidentally... did you get permission to use that copyrighted picture of Katie Coates? I thought not. Thou shalt not STEAL.......

[Adam]

Where exactly does the bible teach tolerance? I know it teaches that God has a perfect standard and that nobody can enter heaven unless they follow that standard. Since every man fell short of this through Adam, God offered us forgiveness through Jesus Christ as He had planned before making the world.

The only places in the bible I know of tolerance occurring offhand were:
a) In the book of Joshua, the Israelites didn't follow God's command to kill everyone in the land that they were invading, but instead tolerated them in their midst, allowing the natives pagan rituals to live on and cause more corruption amongst the Israelites.

b) In Acts 5, the pharisee Gamaliel preached tolerance towards Paul and etc and they were released. Since God used this for good, everyone seems to think that this was a good idea, yet few stop to think that Gamaliel was a pharisee, and we know (I hope) what kind of reputation the pharisees held with Jesus.

Tolerance is not biblical; the bible teaches an ABSOLUTE standard. Tolerance falls under what secular people think of as loving, but is it really loving if I refuse to tell my unbelieving friend that he/she is going to hell? No. People
all too often seem very afraid to actually tell people the truth. Why? The truth can hurt, and people may not like it. Look what happened to Jesus: he had 5,000 people following Him before he preached about picking up your cross and following Him. After that, the multitude vanished. He was very loving, yet He preached absolute truth rather than tolerance because tolerance isn't biblical.

[T.J.]

We are judging the fruit of pole dancing.....does it lead you into a deeper relationship with Jesus? This Katie Coates girl (I guess the pix at the top) seems to be in a circus. She also has hardly any clothes on. She also is writhing around a pole , which.....(we are all adults here) is a phallic symbol.

So as a female, judging the fruit of pole dancing, I'd say....
CHRISTIAN WOMEN , JUST POWER WALK. It's good exercise and Christ honoring.

[Amy]

May God have mercy on us all. Father God, in the name of Jesus, forgive me for judging these people. You can show up and show out in any bar, strip club, or a mall. I do know that you tell us to present our bodies as a living sacrifice, holy, and acceptable to you. Father, help us to learn that we can "win" people to Jesus without compromising and doing things the world's way. Yes, Jesus went were the sinners were, however, I don't recall reading the Word that He started a bar or a club (whether a fitness club or a nightclub). Help me to understand how to minister to those who are blinded. Help me to pray for those who are leading people astray. Even if "66" people did say the "sinner's prayer", please send true ministers of the Word to disciple them. I pray for a move of your Holy Spirit to convict the hearts of these people who are trying to promote "pole dancing" to begin to live a life of holiness. I am not the judge, Father, you are. I ask that we never cause anyone to stumble. Forgive us, Father, for we so often do not know what we do. Have YOUR way, Holy Spirit, and we crown you Lord of the Outcome in this situation. AMEN.

[JessilynT]

Merry--If you seriously think MY comment was the rudest then you need to go back and read EVERYTHING. I will NOT apologize. Why would you "recoil" at the sight of the word unless it makes you adknowledge something about yourself you didn't want to? All the hateful words you are all spewing at me & these women you never met (& do not have the opportunity to defend themselves!)& you cry over that?!

My question has still not been answered...
How is it "filth", "sexual immorality" or a "commission of adultery of the heart" if the only man I dance for is the husband I married in a house of God?

I noticed no one answered Jacqui about KT's picture being stolen either. Obviously you don't want to adknowledge it.

T.J.--Don't assume to know what I read, that would be ignorant. What is your definition of pornography, considering nudity & sexual activity is NOT including in dancing? Do you consider all forms of dance pornographic or only when it's an attractive woman?

[T.J.]

Oh here we go....I have had this very conversation over at the Alan Keyes website with a "liberal" christian who thinks soft porn is fine,,,ok in the marriage bed....etc. etc. and he used the very same words.....what is your definition of pornography......writhing and swinging and twirling around a phallic symbol....(the pole) is pornographic. Tell me why in the world do women do it in strip clubs? To arouse men.....so how can a christian woman do it where it is only exercise...when the lady of the clip said it makes them feel more sexy and confident. The pix of Katie was obviously used to SHOW THE PORNOGRAHY OF THE DANCE....not to rip off her identity...but to show that pole dancing is pornographic. The women feel "sexy" because it does empower them...power and control over men and their sex drive....American Woman playing in the background only emphasizes the spirit behind it. Lesbianism is all about female empowerment..that is why I made the connection that this could even possibly be lesbian training ground....

so if this "exercise" is actually "female empowerment" I think there is a problem. I am a strong woman and personality...yet according to God's word...my HUSBAND is the head of the household and he has the final say. I am the weaker vessel and understand my husband is my covering. FOr a strong woman that takes a lot of humility and a LOT of prayer. But therein lies the secret to my happiness. I surrender it all at the cross....not THE POLE....

[Mrs. Pilgrim]

Thank you, Jessilyn, for your obvious demonstration of discernment. The fact that I walk into things in the dark when I'm not wearing my glasses is proof perfect that I am indeed a pathetically frumpy housewife who has no self-confidence. After all, poised and confident, supermodel look-alike "empowered women" can see in the dark, right? Right?

My husband would deeply disagree with your sight-unseen assessment of my appearance and sexiness--but to demonstrate that fact to you, I would have to reveal things that I don't believe are any of your business. Maybe that's a foreign concept to you, dearie, but some things simply aren't discussed by polite people.

That you connect erotic dancing with "female empowerment" is disturbing, because that would suggest that you believe that only women who are exploited in the most demeaning way are actually powerful. Frankly, your sudden attack of hysteria and invective tends to be more indicative of a lack of self-confidence and a feeling of being threatened than anything I've said. If your "empowerment" is so fragile that it can't withstand criticism, you indeed are in a precarious position.

As for myself, I have grown beyond the need for power. I prefer instead to serve, and to be loved. Maybe that sounds undesirable to you--and if it does, I do feel terribly sorry for you, because you still don't understand your situation. Jesus is a Man; Jesus is God; Jesus is KING. If you can't submit, then you are not His.

Now, would you mind taking a few deep breaths and TRYING to converse like a civilized human being, instead of (oh, God forgive me) a middle-aged radical feminist suffering from PMS?

[Emma]

As JessilynT said - don't knock it till you've tried it!

Do you not all realise that it is just another form of dance? They're doing it for fitness and themselves. How many of you have ever even been near a pole to give it a go?? Im guessing not many if any at all, so how about you try and see what skill it takes to actually do some of the moves first before criticizing.

Are we not told that Jesus loves us all?? So how about you respect that and accept that not everyone is as old fashioned in their views as you.

We are in the 21st Century - how about we open our eyes to all the new and exciting things it has to offer!

[Al]

What am I missing here?

The "pole" originated in strip joints. Is it now being used for "exercise"? Oh, please!

And, that business of wearing stiletto heels to "enhance" the thighs and "rear end?" Give me a break! Women have worn heels of all sorts, and their purpose was to make their calves look more revealing, and the reason for that was for MEN!

Did any of you defenders of this "excercise" method read the story?? It's heavily laced with "sexy."

"Ballet on a pole?" How many ballet dancers wear acrylic stiletto heels?

This is reminiscent of "Christian yoga" and the attempt to sanitize it by "we only use it for exercise."

I ain't buying it!

[aj]

I must say Im actually very disappointed by the reaction from you Christians. Where in the Bible does it say to be judgemental and insult people when you do not have a clue what you are talking about?
Im not on here to spew out some offensive comments, by calling people 'IDIOTS' etc, and by presuming that all pole dancing classes,whether in a gym or in a strip club,will result in a 'LESBIAN ORGY', is only showing how narrow minded and ignorant you are.
Who are you to judge people who you do not know a thing about? And im also guessing you have never seen a pole dance class in your life, let alone set foot in a strip club.
There are pole dance classes all over the world, used purely for FITNESS,not to exploit their bodies. Youre saying that 'why dont they just power walk instead' - would you say that to a gymnast? Or a tennis player? No, because its a personal choice and all about VARIETY. We have a lot to live for in this world, and if freedom of choice is a part of anything these days then I suggest you keep your nasty accusations to yourself.
At the end of the day, what these women choose to do is ABSOLUTELY NONE OF YOUR BUSINESS. Why do you care so much? Why dont you just concentrate on your own love for God and living your own life the way that you think God intended - do not hate on others. People like you give Christianity a bad name,its so disappointing.
And before the accusations start AGAIN from these ignorant people, I am a law student, not a stripper. But i have always been taught not to judge people, as you dont know a thing about them. If you have as many nasty and ignorant opinions on such an issue of pole fitness (trivial),then Id hate to see what else you have these type of opinions on, you must lead a very sheltered life. Concentrate on living your own life the way that God intended you to - dont waste time being counter productive and insultive of others when you have no place to say anything.
Now I have made no personal insults in this post like so many others have, so I hope there will be no need for name calling ( which im sure the Bible doesnt approve of), Im just trying to get you people to open your minds and hearts a bit more.

[T.J.]

We are to live a life different from the world. If pole dancing is incorporated into a Christians life , I judge that as wordly. The pole originated in strip clubs...not revival meetings!! So to bring something from a strip club into your walk with Jesus is not VARIETY...it seems CARNAL....

[Larry F.]

The pastor's last name is really IGNOBLE!? How apropos!

[aj]

I give up... the only similarity is that they use a pole.They dont both strip. Thats a big enough difference for me.
And pole dancing actually originated in the circus, using tent poles,and was a form of ligitimate dance and entertainment,and did not have a revival in strip clubs until the 1980s... Once again showing your ignorance when you have not investigated the facts. You are basically judging an ancient art on the last few decades, you might aswell judge the whole of American presidency on George Bush if thats the case..
Unless you are wanting to say that to bring something from medieval entertainment into your walk with Jesus is carnal, I suggest you read up a bit more.
Thats all I can say on the subject, I am only repeating what I said before that you obviously need to understand it a bit more before you judge it - another narrow minded comment that you have no proof behind - 'pole dancing originated in strip clubs', and you have been proved wrong.No wonder these women are having a hard time detaching it from the stigma, when there are people with these opinions that dont have a clue.

[T.J.]

Ok...fine you say it originated in the circus. Well if we look close enough we'll see that most of the church in America has become a circus.,..good analogy. The women dancing aorund the poles have no identity is CHrist, otherwise they would not need to stoop to such blatant attempts to develop some self-confidence. Was not the medevial period the same as the DARK AGES....let's do some math on WHY THAT WAS......when our spiritual minds become confused and we replace TRUTH with what ever is right in our own minds...(or the political correctness of the day) we become DARKENED in our understanding....the dark ages and the medival period gave us much superstition, fear and confused souls. Exactly what these pole dancing women are portraying...confused souls. They think it's like a maypole I guess...(which has it's OWN pagan issues)....so are we talking CHristianity and followers of Jesus or medevial twirling circus girls who have thrown in some spirituality? WOuld you believe that MANY believers think Yoga is ok too? It's the blind leading the blind as they do their poses of false deities and dance around their "maypoles"......stop the madness.....come out from the worldy ways into a true walk with Christ.

[djackson]

AJ you say "And pole dancing actually originated in the circus, using tent poles,and was a form of ligitimate dance and entertainment,and did not have a revival in strip clubs until the 1980s..."

This is not true, from what I've researched it's actually much older and pole dancing has ALWAYS centered around sensuality.

http://www.dancepages.com.au/articles/view/49/ - tells of the history of pole dancing, and this is a dance article.

Circuses started using the idea and adapted the dance into their own stylized routines. But Pole Dancing in general has always had sexual conotation. And for THIS REASON ALONE this is why Christians should stay far away from it.

Also what's the deal with the strip club style glass stilettos? These are meant for eroticsm. Why not just use ballet shoes, or gym shoes if Pole Dancing is not about sensuality? But, alas, no matter how much you defend pole dancing, in this culture, it is ALWAYS associated with strip clubs.

Please, don't bring this erotic dance into Christian churches or homes, you will make people stumble in sin, whether it's your husband or others, and for this reason alone, as Paul says, you should give it up. Jesus actually had much stronger words about such people who cause others to sin.

AJ you are not thinking about anyone else but yourself, and yet you tell everyone else that THEY are narrow minded. You might as well call Jesus, Paul and the other Apostles narrow minded too because they have a lot to say against bringing the things of the world into a life that is meant to honor God.

I would advise you seek what the Word of God says about bringing worldly things into your life, before you go defending. Ask yourself. Does this honor God? Does this make others stumble? Does this have any connection to sensuality and immorality? If so get rid of it! For it's better to "cut off your hand" than enter hell with both - Strong words from our Lord.

[Adam]

I would have though this should be a straight forward post, but apparently such is not so.

Starting from the top, I wouldn't declare dancing on a pole as the root of lesbianism, though I also remain far from totally throwing out this point. The best verse I know regarding female sodomist behavior would be Romans 1:26;

"For this reason God gave them up to their
vile passions. For even women exchanged the
natural use for what is against nature."

But the first 3 words of this sentence should signal that we have to beacktrack to figure out the 'why' of this verse. If you go all the way to verse 22, you find what 'this reason' is:

"Professing to be wise, they became fools,
and changed the glory of the incorruptible
God into an image made like corruptible man..."

So, the root of sodomistic behavior in this case was self-righteousness, idolatry and otherwise profaning God's name with things corruptible. Given how the world around us is continually turning to more idols of all sorts, from money to false gods and people falsely claiming to be gods, it would seem that based upon this verse we are going to more and more somdomism, and I hold this conclusion as an observable fact. There are also many scientists who claim to be wise but have really made fools of themselves by preaching their evolution and etc.

This, from a Christian standpoint, seems as though it should be very obvious and avoidable, but then why is it we have things like erotic church services, homosexual 'marriage', church services about having better sex in marriage and other things that are pulling sodomistic behavior into the church, never mind all the other heresies that the church has fought against since it's foundations ~2000 years ago? Well, the points from the above verse hold true for Christians too.

We live in this world because we have been called to be God's ambassadors to this world, yet the Church has struggled since it's foundation to stay clear of the influence of the world. Almost every epistle in the New Testament lamented how churches had given into worldliness and had fallen into sodomy, and that trend continues today, although our epistles are not inspired scripture. By adopting the worldly tactic of using sex to sell everything, we will only bring upon ourselves God's wrath and the consequences of Romans 1 among the many other consequences mentioned in the bible.

Pole dancing, be it even for exercise, is still a dangerous dance with worldliness. I am by no means an expert on the field, but a brief browse through a number of websites advertising 'pole fitness' has shown to me that these classes are largely promoted by 'sexiness', many sites including silhouettes of naked women or women in provocative poses. Even the comments in the video posted on the Ledger website contain many comments talking about how their 'empowerment' makes them feel sexy. They may not frequently use the actual word, but most every comment has some mentioned element of sexiness to it. Not only do I not care an ounce about their libido, but in promoting 'sexy' pole dancing as an activity suiting of Christians they are profaning the name of Christ. Also, they don't need to resort to nudity for this to be sinful since sin is rooted in the heart.

Even if you feel that Christians have a 'right' to such behavior because we are free from the Law, you missed the Jerusalem Council in Acts 15 where in verses 19-20 they discuss the restriction of Christian liberty for the sake of unity.

Finally, the other thing that is wrong with this whole 'pole fitness' routine is it a group of women trying to find satisfaction through themselves. The only 'empowerment' there is in the Christian walk is being so caught up in Christ that we focus on Him, His glory and the fact that He saved us, forgetting about our own sinful state, and in that we find strength and joy. To seek satisfaction and empowerment through self is equivalent to what Buddhists do, and Buddhism is a false religion.

[lively4Jesus]

all of your opinions are interesting, but the most important issue here is what does GOD's Word say about this...

"Speak to all the congregation of the children of Israel, and say to them: 'You shall be holy, for I THE LORD your GOD AM holy." Leviticus 19:2

"Consecrate yourselves therefore, and be holy, for I [AM] THE LORD your GOD." Leviticus 20:7

"And you shall be holy to ME, for I THE LORD [AM] holy, and have separated you from the peoples, that you should be MINE." Leviticus 20:26

"For you [are] a holy people to THE LORD your GOD; the LORD your GOD has chosen you to be a people for HIMSELF, a special treasure above all the peoples on the face of the earth." Deuteronomy 7:6; 14:2

"For THE LORD your GOD walks in the midst of your camp, to deliver you and give your enemies over to you; therefore your camp shall be holy, that HE may see no unclean thing among you, and turn away from you." Deuteronomy 23:14

i would say that pole dancing qualifies as an unclean thing
among us!

"but as HE [JESUS] who called you [is] holy, you also be holy in all [your] conduct,
"because it is written, "Be holy, for I AM holy." 1 Peter 1:15-16

"Therefore, since all these things will be dissolved, what manner of persons ought you to be in holy conduct and godliness,
"looking for and hastening the coming of the day of GOD, because of which the heavens will be dissolved, being on fire, and the elements will melt with fervent heat?
"Nevertheless we, according to HIS promise, look for new heavens and a new earth in which righteousness dwells.
"Therefore, beloved, looking forward to these things, be diligent to be found by HIM in peace, without spot and blameless;
"and consider that the longsuffering of our LORD is salvation--as also our beloved brother Paul, according to the wisdom given to him, has written to you,
"as also in all his epistles, speaking in them of these things, in which are some things hard to understand, which untaught and unstable people twist to their own destruction, as they do also the rest of the Scriptures.
2 Peter 3:11-16

*Thumbs Down* on pole dancing as a viable/legitimate avenue to share "The Gospel". It would seem that it flies in the face of Scripture in the holy conduct department. This is GOD's opinion not mine. ;)
Be a blessing...read then go & do The Bible!!!

[T.J.]

great post adam and lively for Jesus..I can now go to work this morning knowing I'm not the only rejecting pole dancing.

[Mrs. Pilgrim]

A.J., your semi-literate and irrational "contributions" to this discussion only serve to make me wonder whether they've lowered the standards for law students in the four years since I graduated.

[KingFish]

Ok. I visited an all nude gentlement's "club" a few nights ago just outside of Springfield, MO ...maybe not the best decision for me, but I met and talked to a pole dancer that told me she left CBC College in Springfield, MO after three years to go into nude pole dancing full time. She said her Mother was an AG Pastor...I felt sad for her.

I asked her why she left school. She stated that she wanted to do something crazy!

Now, let's pray for her...and for my lust after her.

[VickyP]

WHAT IS TO BE AFRAID OF IF WOMEN WANT TO CONTROL THEIR BODIES AND MINDS WITHOUT THE IMPUT OR INVOLVEMENT OF MEN?

The men that visit these strip clubs are fools for parting cash to a woman who has ultimate control over him- not the other way round.

I appreciate that everyone has their opinions and bringing this into the church is not the most well thought out of things, probably a slightly foolish thing, but would you stop me from coming to my weekly service if you knew I taught Pole Dancing?;probably not but you would sure treat me differently.

As for men not being allowed to participate, the reason men do not take part is because they DONT WANT TO not because they arent allowed! Imagine the stigma from their male friends if they were percieved to be leaping around on tip toes-and from their wives, if they thought their husbands where attending under an ulterior motive! You all know that is true so why hide behind the fact that you 'wernt invited or given the oportunity'. There are too sides to this im afraid.

The moves I teach are at the most advanced level, requiring immense strengh and power- more than you could ever be able to achieve in a work out down your local gym. The reason very minimal clothing is worn is so that the pole can be gripped safely on the advanced moves; ones which require the person to hold on without the aid of hands or feet.Have you actually visited a reputable site that teaches these skills??

As for "stiring up the lust of the flesh"- give us a break!

Its not our fault that a majority of males (and females it seems) are finding this is making them have sinful thoughts... why would these women want random people lusting after them anyway?

And JessilynT - yes they are repressed and very miss-informed.

Every one is entitled to their views- we mustnt rebuke them for that.

[cc]

Why are you not surprised by the response to this article. Highly religeous people are by far the most intolerant and most judgemental in society. I am righteous. I am pious. Blah, blah, blah. Whatever. Hypocrites.

[Christian Too]

I don’t think there’s anything wrong with Christian women wanting to feel sexy, act sexy and give their husbands a sexy show. Christian women are women too and it’s natural for a woman to feel sexy. What? Just because you love God, you can’t feel sexy? What’s that all about? It’s more about how you “conduct” yourself in public. If you act like a stripper in public, than that’s another thing. But I can certainly love God, and put on a sexy strip show for my well deserving husband, without compromising my committment to God.

[lisa]

I think that God will go into "ALL" the world. Need I say more...

I am a strong believer that has had a shoulder injury after lifting a 300lbs women (long story here)...anyways physio after physio...and my Orthopedic Dr. tells me running would help. He lacked insight re: the need of me wearing two bras for treadmill and cross trainer, one bra for spinning...pole fitness is the best therapy for my shoulder and it has helped my posture too b/c of the girls being big and yes, home grown.

I think infirmity is very active in the church b/c they are told in paoc "not aloud to dance"...David danced, Moses, sisters danced...I am more than 100% certain Esther danced...

I don't think a Christian that can't walk anymore than 500 steps is effective for the Kingdom of God. I see in the pews alot of FAT UNFIT Christians. Isn't their bodies a representation of their spirit? Sick looking to me. PTL and can't put their arms up more than 30 seconds... Your body is the temple for the Holy Spirit...

It is the end times and we have to be FIT FOR THE KINGDOM in every area of our lives.

I told my friend about pole fitness and she said for me to never bring that up with her...that hurt me too b/c we have shared so much over the years...

I challenge anyone in the church to climb that thing and I know they won't be able too!

The pole is a tool just like weights are to a body builder, like proper running shoes to a runner, like a hammer to a house builder...money is also a tool,...like a fishing rod or net to a fisherman,...It's all how you use it.

Anyways, I will continue this pole fitness despite what the church says. They should be focusing on Jesus and not on the Pole. I am fed up with ministries that are more on demonology then on the goodness and grace of God.